There is surely no need to introduce Tom Gabriel ‘Warrior’ Fischer, frontman and founding member of the legendary Hellhammer and Celtic Frost – not to mention the mighty Triptykon, which Tom has always presented as the logic continuation of the latter outfit. A strong personality with a firm opinion on many matters, he has also always displayed a keen sense of self-awareness when it comes to his own music, as well as an open-mindedness that makes conversations with him notably compelling. Visibly in a good mood when we speak, he is happy to make some surprising revelations about both the past and his upcoming endeavours in this new and exclusive interview.

Cult Never Dies: Let’s begin with your last opus, namely Triptykon’s second album, Melana Chasmata, from 2014. In that same year you announced the release of an EP called Aurorae, but that has yet to be released?

Tom Gabriel Warrior: [Laughing] “I’m still alive, so this EP could still see the light of day!”

And would it be comprised of unpublished songs from the sessions for Melana Chasmata, as was the case with the Shatter EP, which featured session material from debut album Eparistera Daimones?

“Yes. There are two songs that did not made it on the [Melana Chasmata] album. We will probably make a new EP before releasing the next album. Recruiting our new drummer Hannes Grossmann [Necrographist, Obscura, Alkaloid] took longer than we expected. Melana Chasmata was released a long time ago and in order to break this silence, there should be an EP of four songs; two new, and the other two we just mentioned. And the next album will be released next year, hopefully.”

Good news indeed. While listening to Monotheist and the two Triptykon albums, one can really hear a new element that was brought to your music; namely the low-tuned guitars, slower riffs and the slower songs overall. This has also manifested on stage, since you play the Celtic Frost songs at a slower pace.

“This is no longer the case. When we reformed Celtic Frost in the 2000s, we played the songs slowly because we wanted them to be heavier. But with Triptykon, I stopped doing that, I don’t think it really worked. I now think that we have to play the songs with a tempo as close as possible to the original albums. The only song that is still played a bit slower is Procreation Of The Wicked, because it has that heavy side. We play all the other songs at a speed very similar to the album. Regarding low tuning, I know it’s a real problem for a lot of people. As far as I’m concerned, it’s a non-problem. We started experimenting with low tunings in the first era of Celtic Frost. Black Sabbath started using down tuning on Masters Of Reality in 1981. Anything that is necessary to make a song sound as it should does not bother me at all.”

I asked as I am interested in the motivations behind this decision – when Monotheist came out, it marked a shift to a much heavier approach for Celtic Frost.

“And that was our intention. When I was a kid in the 1970s, all the bands I loved – like Nazareth, Status Quo or Genesis – became very commercial over the years. They became the kind of bands that housewives listened to, bands that are in the charts. And I did not want to be like that. So here I am in my mid-fifties, and of course my albums are heavy, I like that. I do not want to end up like Genesis!”

To this date, Triptykon hasn’t recorded any cover songs, while Celtic Frost earned a reputation for covering unexpected bands, such as Wall of Voodoo’s song ‘Mexican Radio’. Are you still interested in covers today?

“I think about it occasionally. But on the other hand, I do not really feel the need to do it. It was a kind of spleen that pushed us to make a cover and change it completely. I already did it, so now it’s not a necessity. But there are some songs that were very important to me when I was growing up and in my journey as a musician, and I sometimes think about working on covers with Triptykon. It could be done someday. But as long as we have enough material with our own music, it’s only an option.”

What can you tell me about Triptykon’s third album so far? Have you planned to use old Celtic Frost demos again or have you used everything that could be exploited?

“There are still a lot of Celtic Frost demos and maybe I’m going to use some of them, not because I’m lacking inspiration, but because I’ve rewritten them in order to use them. Celtic Frost was a democracy and Monotheist was a very long album already. We worked for five and a half years on it, and wrote a ton of songs. So we had to make a selection but there was a lot of quality material. It’s possible that one or two of there will end up on the next album. In my point of view, as Triptykon is a continuation of Celtic Frost, it’s very legitimate. But there is also a lot of new music. How to describe the album? In fact, I think we have found our sound with Triptykon and we are very satisfied with it. What I can tell you is that it will be a little darker and maybe a little less direct, adding a small experimental touch. Overall, it will sound like Triptykon, obviously. I’ve done a lot of radical experimentations in my life, I’ve done it already, so I’m very happy to just play the music I like today. I don’t really want to do anything radically different today with Triptykon.”

Are you planning on using H. R. Giger artworks for these Tritptykon releases?

“The next Triptykon album will have a cover by Giger and it will be the last one. It will also be the last cover on which H. R. Giger was involved while he was alive, and for which he approved all the details. I made the design for Melana Chasmata and the next one at the same time and submitted them for his approval. But after that, I think we will no longer use his art, despite the fact that his widow has offered me the possibility to do it. I think we shouldn’t do it without his approval. And I must say that it becomes tiresome after a while, with all the respect I owe him. I think a triptych with Giger is enough and I would like to be able to do something else afterwards.”

Do you often hear the influence of your music in other bands? Do you ever think ‘Oh, I wonder if they’ve listened to my music’?

“It would be pretty pathetic of me to sit down and listen to bands to see if they sound like me. It is just not how I am. But it happened to me once, by pure coincidence, in the 90s. I was in a metal record shop with Martin Ain, and they were playing a song that sounded so much like Celtic Frost that it was almost disturbing. We went to see the guy who was working at the shop to ask him what it was and he showed us a Darkthrone album. It really sounded like a song from Morbid Tales. But it’s really the only time it happened to me. In fact, I listen to very little metal at home. I’m more into 70s prog rock, jazz and hard rock.”

There is often a tendency among older musicians to be very sceptical about contemporary music. This is not the case with yourself it would seem though, since you often show your support for young bands, one recent example being Germany’s Valborg, one of several unusual groups you selected as curator of Roadburn festival in 2010.

“They do something out of the ordinary and I like it. I like a band that has a vision and the courage to try to go on a completely different path than everyone else. For example, I [also] booked Dive, a Belgian band. It is an electro industrial solo project that has nothing to do with metal, but the music is really radical, and I thought it was an interesting experiment to have them there.”

Can we expect a reissue of the Apollyon Sun records, as these are quite hard to find nowadays?

“I do not know, I don’t even know who owns the rights today. They were held by Rod Smallwood, the former Iron Maiden manager, via his Sanctuary Records label. Then the label went bankrupt and everything was sold to Universal, then they had a problem with the competition authorities, because they had acquired too much music rights. They were forced to sell some of it to BMG. But I do not know if Apollyon Sun was part of this contract. So I do not know anything about the situation and Apollyon Sun never went anywhere because we had disagreements with our label... We separated from the label on the day of the album release, so there never really was any promotion on it. And it must be anything but interesting to release [from the perspective of] another label. You have no guarantee that it will sell. You have to promote it as a new album and is it a good move for a record that utterly sounds like the 90s? I don’t think so!” 

“The ex-members of the band occasionally offered me to reform the band, and it has also crossed my mind, but not with much enthusiasm. I’m actually working on a new project called Niryth with three other people. At the very beginning, before we had our own songs, we had planned to rework two Apollyon Sun songs in a completely different way. But in the end, we wrote so much music of our own that this idea died too. So I think the fate of the group is sealed.”

In your career, you have both re-recorded songs and remastered albums. For example, To Mega Therion and the songs ‘The Usurper’ and ‘Jewel Throne’ – why didn’t you re-record the whole album?

“Because at the time, we were nobody, just a little underground band. We were very dissatisfied with the sound of the album and we had a lot of problems with the producer. We asked the label to remix the whole album and they refused because it was too expensive. They said we could remix three tracks for one EP [Tragic Serenades], but that was it. So we remixed these three tracks and the only parts that were re-recorded were Martin Ain’s bass lines, because he was no longer part of the band at the time of recording To Mega Therion. And obviously, it sounded much better.”

In the To Mega Therion booklet, we read that the album is dedicated to the space programs Mercury and Gemini, as well as Apollo 1 and ‘Gus’ Grisson, a NASA astronaut who died during a pre-launch test for the latter mission. Is this a subject that still interests you?

“Of course, it has always fascinated me. And that’s something that I shared and still do, with Reed St. Mark, our drummer at the time. We were very interested in the subject. If you could see my home, it’s basically a huge library, with books on space flights and many other things like that.”

Do you think it inspires you in terms of your music?

“Maybe not directly, but obviously it influences my frame of mind. Being interested in space travel, quantum physics, the whole question of our place in this universe, and how it all works, must have some form of influence over the lyrics.”

In the Monotheist liner notes, we read that ‘Rex Irae (Requiem)’ from Into The Pandemonium and ‘Winter’ from Monotheist are two parts of a requiem that Celtic Frost was supposed to finish later. Considering that you wrote both songs, do you have plans to complete this requiem?

“I’m actually planning on finishing the third part, but I can’t talk about it yet. A proper announcement regarding this matter will be done soon… I started this requiem in 1986, so in 2019, I will have spent 33 years finishing it. And I did not really have any ideas on how to finish it, I just wrote the first part and I knew that someday I would finish it. Obviously, I was hoping to finish it with Celtic Frost, but since Triptykon exists to succeed Celtic Frost, I do not see any problem in it being done by this band.”

Celtic Frost, just like Triptykon, never released a true live album, despite delivering quite intense performances on stage. Could you release archive live recordings in the future?

“At the very end of Celtic Frost, we were working on an album and live DVD, because we had recorded a lot of concerts from the last tour. But the internal conflicts became so important that I left the band and the project was buried. The project was really special, it would have been a companion disc to Monotheist, with the best demos we had done for the album, as there are some really interesting things in there, and then live versions of the songs from the album.” 

“For Triptykon, I don’t know. To be honest, I’m a very bad guitarist and if someone records me professionally, everybody would be able to hear how imprecise and bad I am, so I don’t know if it’s a good thing! [Laughs] It might happen. We haven’t planned anything like that, because I don’t really see the point. I love being in the studio and creating something at a very high level. I am very satisfied with the production of Monotheist and the two Triptykon albums and I would like to continue on this path. On stage, you don’t have that control over things. We released two live songs on Shatter, so maybe we’ll do something like that, on a smaller scale than an album. Never say never!”

Since you say ‘never say never’, is this Celtic Frost live album project completely buried?

“It was buried when I left the band. Because Martin and I had signed a contract stating that the group could only exist if we both were part of it. We felt both very strongly about this. Martin told me after I left the band that we would play music together again someday, and I said, ‘I don’t think so, not this time.’ And now he’s dead...” 

“I miss Celtic Frost, you know. Unlike the personal conflicts we had, which were terrible and destroyed everything. But I miss this band and even if I play this music on stage, it’s obviously very different from being part of Celtic Frost. I have sometimes considered making a tribute thing with Reed St. Mark, because he is the original drummer and he remains one of my best friends today. But I don’t know if he can still play like he used to, just as I don’t know if I should do this tribute, because Triptykon exists, and we carry the legacy of Celtic Frost. I don’t know if it makes sense.” 

“And on the other side, I’m working on another side project. [Laughs] Because I was in Hellhammer before Celtic Frost. The difference is that the vast majority of the music of Hellhammer has never been performed on stage, because this band never played live. So I’m going to make a tribute band with some people I really trust and who, I think, really understand this type of music. They don’t just do it like mercenaries. And we will most certainly perform these songs on stage in a very respectful way, as a tribute to Hellhammer, we do not pretend to be the band. It’s really because these songs have never been played live, and I would like to have that opportunity before I die.”

You said you had planned to release the Monotheist demos, could that be done?

“No, when I left Celtic Frost, I decided that I did not want to generate any more money for the last drummer of the band, who for me is the person responsible for the separation of the band. And every time I release something he’s been involved in, he’s going to get some money out of it, for my music. I thought that was enough. He has toured the world through my music and I consider that I have given him enough for the role he had in the destruction of Celtic Frost. So as long as I live, it will not happen.”

“The answer is not over, because it sends us back to what you asked me earlier…When Martin died last October, I thought, ‘Maybe we should pay him a tribute’. So I contacted the ex-members of Celtic Frost, our label and our manager. I suggested to do an EP tribute to Martin, which would include some unpublished demos. There are demos without the last drummer of the band and I wanted to take some of these songs. There are also two covers, which Martin did with Celtic Frost. It was his idea and he completely changed them. The result is very interesting and experimental.” 

“So we would have made a four-song EP and the money would have been donated to a charity cause to which Martin contributed, which protects the orangutan in Africa. It would have been for a good cause, nobody would have made any money out of it. But we contacted the rights holders of the two original songs, and they refused to give us their permission. So this project died because of that. We sent them the Celtic Frost versions and they probably thought we had worked them too much, despite their quality. Martin was really at the top of his game when he worked on this. Everything was ready for the release, including the design of the EP, which was supposed to be a gatefold. It would have been a fitting tribute to Martin Ain.”

Interview by Antoine ‘Neredude’ Thedupe, late Summer 2018. Band photo by Ester Segarra.